Help me understand please

Guys I have been testing and testing my water is confusing me alot. First let me say when I got into salt I already had my 180 gallon fresh tank that I still have so Point being that I asked the lfs what I needed to get into salt water tank. Now keep in mind that I share a building at work with this lfs and so he did alot of explaining to me about buy good stuff with salt its important. I asked him about the water and he told me the only thing you test for is amonia, nitrates,nitrites and ph. Now he helped me out with selling me stuff that we special ordered in he kept saying be paitient. I cycled the tank and waited 6-8 weeks before adding any fish and did so one by one over months. Ok not to ramble im relly looking to understand here and just telling the story. I ordered 120 lbs of live rock and let the cycle happen added fish after 6-8 yada yada.... Well point is he never told me about calicum or magniseum or kh all I knew is ok my ph is ok nirtates nitrates ok and amonia... So then I got some more live rock from a fello hobbiest 100lbs but we transfered right from one tank to bucket to my house into mine so then it happened!!!! My pink purple all of it faded..... This is when I hear hows your calicum? I was huh? so point of story I get the tests I have readings of 18o for kh 320 for calcium and mag is 6something so I start trying to understand and start taking with someone I know at a salt water store and he is telling me my kh is low but my test says its high ? he varified my mag and calcium is low my ph is all over the place and I guess im trying to ask please help explain this to me or can anyone help me find a easy reading to understand this. I have a ton of money into this and I would love to enjoy this hobby the way I did fresh water for 15 years. I have more fun with salt but really want to get it. I have been fascinated with this and Darn it im going to get it I just need direction! Thank any of you that take time to help me. I did a search and dident find anything in here but hey maybe its just my head in my butt or something.

 

so do you want it to be a FOWLR or are you going to be keeping corals?
and yes Coraline algae needs calcium and other stuff to flourish.
I use purple up with great results.there are also other supplements on the market that have everything in one bottle.

also what kind of water did you use to fill the tank and what kind of water are you using for top offs? also what is the salinity reading of your water?

 

Lot to take in all at once. I am not the expert here, I am just online so here you go.

Your KH is too high should be 10 - 12, your mag is too low, should be 1400 and your calcium is too low, should be 400 - 500. Good that your other numbers ar oK. When you add live rock it WILL disrupt the nature of things so thats normal .

Something else you need to test for is specific gravity or salinity. should be around 1.023 tp 1.026. There is a device to test this, not your standard test kit.






A few questions,
What Salt do you use ?
What do you use for water and Top off water ?
How often have you done water changes ?

Once these are answered, more of the old timers will chime in to help as well I'm sure..


\Good luck

 

I have a 4 chamber corilife ro unit for top off and water changes im about to do a 40 gallon waterchange tommorrow with water I mixed yesterday I store 10 gallons at a time for top off and do usually do 20-30 gallon wc at the interville at 3-4 weeks maybe its not enough. Again im used to fresh water and I have time to do more if needed. I know the calcium should be 400 plus and I have been adding calcium and mag. It seems like its not going up I took my water to a guy that does mostly salt water and he told me kh was low calcium is low and mag is low so im lost I feel I am not testing right I get to a point that I feel im understanding of this and then blamo im lost again. Not to mention my lr has alge all over it and looks like poop. I was to put corals in this eventually as well and some nice fish. My best fish is my sailfin tang and my clowns. I dont want to add anything else until I understand water chemistry.. I am paitient and want to learn I think I was mislead by my neighbor at the pet shop and he has actually gon out of buisness and I blught most of his stuff for my landscape buisness for the pond division. So I now use someone else and things seem like my tests dont match his and im lost!

 

Besides the fact that there have been books written on marine water chemistry, I can try to sum it all up for you in a couple paragraphs.

Aside from keeping nitrates down, nitrates really don't have a direct impact on calcium, alkalinity, mag, pH. So let's toss them aside for now.
Secondly, you didn't mention about salinity, so I'm going to assume you understand the importance of keeping your salinity at a consistent level by keeping your tank topped up with fresh RO water.

Now, with that aside, you stated that you have been monitoring your pH. A good marine (saltwater) pH should be kept between 8.2-8.4, but whatever you decide to keep it at (or aim for), you should never let it deviate all over the place (let it go up or down). Now there is where alkalinity comes into play. A good alkalinity will buffer your pH. This means, that if your alkalinity is low, your pH is much more likely to deviate (usually towards the downward direction). Get your pH between 8.2-8.4, then ensure that your alkalinity at a fair level.

Now, this is where things become difficult (if not complicated). Alkalinity and calcium have a love-hate relationship (they've seen Dr. Phil, but with no resolve). This means that typically, without a good magnesium level (I'll get into this in a sec), one will drop while trying to raise the other. So let's say your Calcium is sitting at a nice 400, but your alkalinity is low (we'll say 1.5 meq for example); you go ahead and add some buffer solution to raise your alkalinity. 6 hours later, you check your alkalinity and you seemed to have bumped it up a fair bit- great!? Not really- because you check your calcium and realize that it has shot down to 300. This can work the opposite as well. Your alkalinity is high, but your calcium is sitting at 250; you toss in some calcium supplements. This raises your calcium, but drops your alkalinity. Its a lose lose battle.

But, even though Dr. Phil may not have been able to reconcile their differences, a certain Dr. Magnesium can. This is where Magnesium plays a major role in balancing this relation. A good magnesium level (1300-1450) will, quite simply, prevent these ups and downs between calcium and alkalinity. The typical ratio of magnesium to calcium is 3:1 respectively (If your Calcium is 450, Mag should be 1350). This will then ensure that your alkalinity wont cause your calcium to bottom out, when you try and raise your alkalinity.

Now, in reference to your corraline algae (the purple-reddish-pink encrustment that has covered your rocks), that you state is going white (a term called bleaching)... Corraline algae is just like any other coral, however much simpler- still relying on basic coral building principal. It requires a good level of alkalinity and calcium at the same time (as stated earlier- magnesium will help maintain this). You can't allow either of these to become defficient or else growth will cease and health will tumble shortly after.

In summary. Focus on getting your magnesium at a proper level. Once this is achieved, work on keeping your alkalinity and calcium at decent levels, which will ensure a stable pH.

.. Remember, that was a short short short summation of how the main marine chemistry works- it is in no way the "total" reliable form of reef keeping. There are a huge array of other factors that will affect chemistry, and you should read up on those as well! Good luck with everything, and hopefully this has given you a tiny bit of insight on how to handle your situation.

Remember, this is a tricky hobby; don't feel down if things aren't going as planned. Learning about ways maintain a marine aquarium to conditions that mimic the sea is the most rewarding and exciting part about this hobby. Have fun- and always take it slow

 

What brand of salt ?
I ask because there are brands that will give you the mag and ca thatyou need with no supliments, which is a bonus

 

Read this.

I use Bulk Reef Supply for Ca, Mg. and Alk. Fairly inexpensive, straight-forward, and not too difficult. To maintain proper levels, though, you must know what to shoot for. Read the article above.

It would be helpful too if you let us on to what you plan to keep. Corals? Fish?

Good luck!!

 

Phayes Thank you you mad some sense to me I did not understand the role of Magnesium and realize and from what your saying raise that first and the others will be easier to maintain? I believe that to be what my lfs has been working with me on. I dont mean to sound ignorant with this I just am trying to have better understanding. I am trying to get mag and calcium up at the same time and spent over 100 in 2 weeks trying to do so my ph has shifted and ive used ph buffer to help there Then now the lfs said my kh needs to come up I now have added kh plus.

double2 its oceanic salt that I am using I got 4 5 gallon pails for free from my neighbor when he loft the pet store. He ordered them in for me when he was going out so they were not sitting around they are new I dont know if that matters?

Reefsparky I want to have corals with a few very nice fish I dont need to overload with fish I have a beautiful sailfin tang and really if I had 4-5 other fish this size I would be happy. I want clear water and corals with a few fish I dont need a ton of fish in my 220

 

Since you have brought up the algae tidbit, here I go again...

Algae requires two major products in your aquarium... Nitrates and phosphate. You already know about how nitrates get into your aquarium. But phosphates also appear, typically from animal waste, and also from feeding. Together, phosphates and nitrates become the ultimate Algae food. Its important to test for phosphates and nitrates because as you have seen, algae is an eye sore and it doesn't stop there. Aside from the larger macro algae, there is micro algae that causes coral growth to cease. A phosphate reading of less than 0.1 is desired. A phosphate reading of 0.3-0.5 or more, will pretty much ensure that your corraline algae or other stony corals will no longer have a chance to grow because of being covered in a micro film algae that, in essence, smothers them.

Getting rid of phosphates and nitrates is not an easy task. It is probably in the top 5 list of questions asked on these forums or any other saltwater forum on the net. And the answer? There is a hundred of them- from fancy filters to chemical additives, to refugiums to the "skimmer replacing, filter replacing, carbon replacing, yada yada yada" post that haunts us all about Inland Aquatics selling algae scrubbers (You guys all know which post Im talking about). The important thing is to find something for your tank, that works, and stick with it. I won't get into any of these methods, because a book could be written on it, and im sure one has been.

Really though, don't worry about the algae right now... Get your pH, alk, calc, and magnesium under control, and THAN worry about fixing the algae problem, and than you can start adding all those fancy shmancy corals that you've been eyeballing!

Good luck again!

Keep us updated, and always feel free to continue asking questions!

 

phayes again thank you I have a reading of 0 on nitrates nitrites and phosphates as well as have phosphate sponges in the wet/dry and dont understand why its there alge but I am not worried about that so much as getting the understanding of the water. I hear that phosphates might show up as 0 though the alge might be eating it to give a false reading?