Plumbing nightmare

Todd Sails and AZDesertRat are two that I know that are great with plumbing. I know there are many others.

 

Ok thanks i'll try to connect with them.

 

Well thanks,
and I am into DIY overflows and plumbing.

I'm not quite surfe I understand the question, or questions however.

Based on those drawings and pictures- seems like you have it under control

 

Really, that would make me a real beaver lol . No seriously. First i have no knowledge of water volume inner workings, i'm guessing. I observe other plans and i read. Now for example, my drains are drilled for a 2" Uflex, now thats fine providing i know what kind of return pump i'll have which i don't know. i know the closed loop pump, its a Pan World Magnetic Water Pumps 50 PX -X 1150 gph with a 1" in & out . But the return i have no idea what to put since i'm not sure if i should have a drain and what size from the top refugium to the sump. ( i've put it in yellow) on the plan that dumps in overflow of the Reef tank. Seahorses and Anglers make a lot of waste. But the plants are there for a reason plus the critters( shrimps, brittles stars...) and pods that why its a refugium.... thats my dilema. I already have a connecting drain in GREEN connecting the biotopes and the reef tank. Can you check it out, please.

 

Your closed loop as drawn in aqua color is not a closed loop. It is a return circuit returning water from the sump to the display.
A closed loop by definition is just that, closed. It does not leave the display tank down to the sump then return. It exits the display via pump and returns to the dipsplay, never leaving the enclosed (closed) piping and never entering the sump.
You will also have flooding problems with it as drawn as it enters the bottom of the display so in a power outage situation the display will drain until the nozzles are exposed to atmosphere and the flow quits. If you intend it to be a return the returns need to be close to the surface so only a small, easily calculated amount of water flows back to the sump before the returns are exposed to atmosphere and you have an air gap breaking the siphon.

In a real closed loop flooding is not an issue and it can be drilled in the bottom because the water is always contained in the pump and piping, it is never exposed to atmosphere thus the "closed" title.

Never ever depend on check valves in aquaria, they can and do fail, it naot a matter of if but when. It will happen and it does not have to be a catastrophic failure, even a grain of sand on a valve seat or sealing surface will flood in time and its usually at the worst possible time like at night or when you are away. A small piece of algae, a snail, an anemone, some frozen food, anything can defeat a check valve so provide the air gap.

 

My God thank you so much i'll make the necessary ajustment;
-First it will not touch the sump in any way but enter the pump directly, therefore the sump pump will keep its place and return the water by itself to the top tank, is that ok?

- Second, The return in the top tank will be on top of the water with a hole to breat the syphon effect in case of like you say power outage, can you concour on that these changes will solve the problem you've pointed out. i'll put a new plan soon. Finally got sketch up lol.

 

The way the closed loop is presently drawn it shows the suction or intake pulling from the sump, not the display so that would need to be corrected for a closed loop.

Just like check valves, I never, ever and I repeat, never rely on drilled holes. I cannot stress this enough. Drilled holes, just like check valves are a false sense of security. They require cleaning and maintenance and even then are easily defeated. A wandering anemone, a snail, a small fish sucked up against the hole when the flow reverses in a power outage, a small piece of algae or scum, some food, anything can defeat it no matter how clean or if you serviced it 5 minutes ago.

We all know water cannot jump uphill so an air gap is idiot proof and requires zero maintanance and cannot be defeated. As long as the returnsstay close to the surface, only a small, easily calculated amount of water can possibly backsiphon before the return is expsoed to atmosphere and the siphon breaks, an air gap, the best form of backflow protection known to man. As long as you keep freeboard or spare capacity in your sump a backflow is impossible from this method. I don't know the dimensions of your display but using the formula LxWxH/231 will get you the gallons of wate rthat can flow back. In my case I have a 60" x18" x23" high 100 gallon display and I have my returns 3/4" below the surface. 60"x18"x0.75"/231=3.5 gallons maximum. So when my power goes off for any reason I get 3.5 gallons flowing back to the sump worst case before the returns are exposed and the siphon breaks, my air gap. Since I have a 30G sump and my skimmer prefers about 9" of water or a little over 1/2 full I know I have plenty of room to contain a worst case backflow with room to spare. I have my levels marked on the side with a sharpie and I know to never fill it past the safe point even if I am going away on vacation. Actually my ATO system maintains the correct level now since I added it several years ago so floods are about impossible from a power outage.

 

This the new plans sorry still learning with sketch up

Still working on it sorry for delays,




Working as fast as i can. will have to change i guess to a syphon plan like you said. see below my questions. I'm slowly getting it. this is huge project, over 9 thousand so far, got to invest time before money. thanks for your time and wisdom. Its not going to waste. Preparing changes to syphon but need input.

 

The plans are not to scale, the program only deals in meters....









My Drain, they worked perfectly the last time never heard a thing





This was on my old tank and it worked very well, but i'm open to new ideas it was behind a Calfo overflow

 

So if i hear you correctly you want me to use a syphon no matter what . The very thing i was trying to avoid the abundance of pipes. So here are my tanks, Reef tank 72"X 18X 19" 100G the Biotope split in two, 72"X 18"X 16"H 80G both starfire, custom made. Question what kind of return pump power to reach the top tank. Should i have a drain going from the top tank, biotope( refugium) to the skimmer or use a seperate mechanical filter for the 80G. It will have seahorses and Anglers both in their seperate biotopes and are very messy habitant.