cycling using Damsels and applied logic

Hi everyone

I know that a great many people choose to cycle using decaying sea food , prawns shrimps etc

but Im sure you will appreciate some of us older school ( middle aged people) will still use the Damsel fish to cycle our tanks

My question

If you can cycle a 30 gallon tank using 1 x YTB damsel because the polutants/ nutrients Ammonia, Nitrite , dont get above levels that this species can tolerate

if you had a 300 gallon tank , could you cycle it using 10 x YTBS

applied logic/ mathematics being checked by myself

1x YTB in 30 gallons creates the same ratio of nutrients as 10 x YTBs would in a 300 gallon tank

and more importantly , if 1 x YTB in a 30 gallon tank created Ammonia level of 0.2 - does it not follow that the same YTB if kept in a 15 Gallon tank, would raise that same parameter to 0.4? its the same amount of waste but only half as diluted

sorry if I have missed some beginner principles with my attempt at applied logic

thanks for reading

Steve

 

If you're going to be stocking slowly, then you can cycle a 300 gallon with 2 or 3 damsels. If you are going to be stocking more quickly, then you'll definately want to go with more damsels up front to increase the bacteria population quicker.

 

Inwall, thank you

I dont have a 300 gallon, or plan to have a 300 gallon ( though its a nice dream I enjoy )
just wanted to check my logic? which based on your reply seems to be OK

Steve

 

You and I are of similar age, Steve, and I've never cycled a tank by any means other than damsels (well, I used my clownfish to cycle my 90 on the advice of a few I trust here). Before my current 90G, I had the same 55G tank for more than 20 years, and before the internet was a viable resource for this hobby, I took the advice of LFS folks and used from 5 to 10 damsels to cycle. I've cycled that tank more than a couple dozen times, I'd guess. I never lost a damsel to a cycle. Not to say I would do it the same way today with so many fish, but with so many theorizing these days, it should be known that 8 damsels in a 55G tank is not too many fish with regard to endangerment.

As for your question, I think you err on the side of caution. Consider the increased increased surface area from the 30G to the 300G tank. Remembering that bacteria populations rise exponentially, the catch-up rate of bacteria to ammonia or nitrites would be greatly reduced. I'd guess your 10 damsel calculation could be safely tripled. I'm not advocating this, but mathematically the numbers work.

My 2 cents.

 

Reefsparky - thank you - I never lost a YTB either, and presently have the dive bombing pair I cycled my current tank with 16 months ago - great fish IMO

Im going to have to reconsider the parameters I was using in my logic formula - thank you

Steve

 

only need 2 or 3 for 300

 

I myself would never use more then one to cycle a 5 or 50K gallon system.
The reason being is I don't want to try and get them out I use one to start and keep the bio demand constant and then when ready I add one new fish at a time with a 2 weeks or more wait in-between additions . Now the reason I would only use one is two can make a pair and as wimpy and shy as a YT Damsel is they get aggressive when they pair off .

Aquariums can not build up excess bacteria add a fish it has to increase in numbers to support the added demand remove a fish and the bacteria will die off to keep the levels at the level of bio demand and that is just as stressful as when bacteria die off the water will become white and hazy and oxygen levels will drop really fast as well from the bacterial die off ..

The dead hunk of meat to cycle with to me is just to unstable for my liking and when I press them people who apply this methoed about how is the demand kept at a steady constant level most say the remove the meat or add more meat .

 

thanks Tangster
fully appreciate what your saying and your perspective on this
I have them as keepers also

not considering doing it, was just checking applied logic in order I could re evaluate my contribution on another thread

Steve

 

I never used fish to cycle my tank. I use live rock and sand. By the time you get the live rock and sand into your tank there is enough dead stuff in there to cycle your tank. This also depends on your tank size ofcource. You need to use proper amount of live rock/sand.

For example 90 lbs live rock and 90lbs live sand should be enough to cycle a 90 gallon tank given enough time.

I don't think cycling is a justifiable reason to put fish through stress.

Also using decaying organic matter to cycle is a bad idea. This can lead to cyanobacteria and brown algae problems.

 

I've always used damsels to cycle my tanks, but make sure you take them out before you add all your live rock, because they can be a ***** to catch, especially when the tank is filled with rock.