Mega-Powerful Nitrate and Phosphate Remover Replaces Skimmer, Refugium, Everythin

From the first paragraph of this thread: "IF anybody has not yet hooked up their refugium or skimmer, or was JUST LOOKING to get rid of these things". It's not telling everyone to dump everyting; it's telling them they can dump things if they want.

Depends what you mean by "stand alone all inclusive". I personally don't include rock or sand in my description of optional filters. So if you are talking about a reef tank with rock, and maybe sand, then adding an algae filter can indeed be a "stand alone all inclusive" filter, needing nothing else. If you include rock and sand as "filters", then no it's not alone.

I'm not selling anything, unlike you. I'm unbiased.

I can't control what other people do. I hope they do make them, so I can buy one.

Each site has folks who needs the information, and some use it, others don't, and some complain about it without ever trying it. And some defend their business of skimmers, be it manufacturing, marketing, selling, PR, promotion, shill posting, or being a paid user. It's money in their pocket.

Of course. A lot of folks fit into the categories I just mentioned.

They can have their opinions, but for an argument to be valid it must hold up to logic. For example, the biggest argument is that "skimmers are best because everyone uses one". This is false logic, learned in day one of debate class.

Yes they, in abscence of logic, had to resort to personal attacks on me and family members, when I did not once attack them (except for miwoodar). And their own video research evidence that they presented as the final proof for thier side turned out to prove my side, because they didn't even view the video before presenting it.

I didn't dismiss anything. I answered every question, and that's when they had to resort to personal attacks, and PM'ing each other in order to get all of them to post at once. I'm not complaing, I know how it works (I work in promotions), and it just boils down to RC needing massive numbers of users/posts in order to make money. But, RC allows personal attacks, including on family members, although it states in their TOS that these are not allowed. So in that type of environment, those with the loudest personal attack, wins. I don't play there.

No, here is why:

SantaMonica, Your account on Reef Central has been suspended. Enough is enough ... Additionally, mounting a campaign by spammer members to "complain to the Mods" will not be tolerated. You're giving advice to people in that thread about how to add people
to the ignore list.... Perhaps that is a skill you should become acquainted with.

Regards,

Mike
RC Admin

Funny, I started that thread by "inviting people by PM" to the thread; didn't cause any trouble then.

So, in addition not attacking them, I tried to reduce the attacks on me by pm'ing others to help. But RC would rather have the attacks. By the way, if you can find an attack by me on someone besides miwooder, I'll paypal you $100 just like the offer I posted there. Of course, not a singe person even tried to collect.

Who cares if it's new or not? The only thing that's new is that it's small.

 

For those interested in algae filtering:

After having run my screen(s) for a while, I'm noticing an interesting situation with the nitrate that might be of interest. This really on applies to other folks once they's already reduce N and P to near zero, but it might good to know for others too.

After getting N and P to zero (Salifert hobby test kits), and keeping everything the same for a few days, I notice that the N start showing again, very very slightly, starting with a barely visible tint (maybe a .1 on the Salifert color scale), then more visible pink (about a .2), and if I leave things alone for a week, it might go all the way to 3. This is happening while P remain zero (absolutely clear on the Salifert phosphate color scale).

Now, I sometimes do over-feeding tests, using massive amounts of stuff that would be considered "pollution" by some folks, and sure enough when I do this I get a small increase in N, but also in P. Then when I go back to normal feeding, the levels go back to zero. But the situation I'm talking about here is not during an over-feeding test. It's just feeding and doing everything else at normally. After about a week the N start a very slight increase, but there is NO increase in P.

So after thinking about what I learned about the relationships between N and P, I remembered that you can sometimes have one of them limiting. I reasoned that P might be limited, and without P the screen can't grow to absorb the N. I wanted to just add P but did not know how, so instead I just fed a bit more. Presto! Zero N again. And again, and again. Every time my normal feeding habbit saw a small rise in N (but not P), it was corrected every time by feeding more! Now that is a nice problem to have. It since has been explained to me why my particular tank might be limiting in P, something to do with my dripping kalk and not using a CO2 reactor. But the solution that was offered was the same: Feed more.

Now of course in order for anyone to get to the point of (possibly) experiencing this situation, you first would have to get your screen to a functioning status, and get your N and P to zero. But it's just one of the smaller points to keep in mind as you fine-tune your setup.

 

A Reader Pulls the Plug!

"Scuba Pro" on the UR site has some good results to tell; here are his complete posts:

9/3: Santamonica after reading through the thread and instructions carefully I am going to give it a try as I like feeding my fish well, means I have bought a skimmer yet I don't like using one due to the food it takes out. I have a couple of questions though: I am going to be doing the sump design version 3. 1) Will the fact that I am not using any timers to create wave affects really affect algae growth that much?? 2) Could I split my display outlet in two and create two of these filters? My sump has four sections! Or would this cause the flow over the sheet to be too slow??

9/9: Well I have set-up the sump version 1 a couple of days ago and its already going very brown. I have decided to actually make either sump version three using a pump or a bucket version on top of my sump, just haven't got the time at the moment. I take it you mean Nitrate and Phosphate readings when referring to N and P?? Also I don't understand why anyone is doubting this. In a natural environment there are no skimmers or mechanical filtration what so ever its all done by nature itself which is basically what we are trying to achieve surely? I can't see there being any drawbacks from trying to put a naturally run filtration system on your tank. I mean Eric Borneman, who in my eyes is one of the best reef keepers and has written books which should be read by anyone looking to succesfully keep a reef aquarium, has a system set-up where by he has a reef tank connected to other tanks where sea grass and other nutrient exporters grow. Now I know this an extreme case but this is ultimately what we are trying to achieve. How people can use their skimmers and UV's and external filters and say that there could be negative effects on your aquarium using a natural fltration method is beyond me. Personally I love the look of this and can totally understand how it works and I have no doubts wether it does or not!!! Just putting my tuppence worth in, not meaning to offend anyone just my opinion.

9/10: Well here are pics of my quick bodge job!! lol. Haven't had time to do it properly. Santamonica can you tell me if it is time to use my fingers under the tap yet?? [pics were not useful]

9/14: Well I have some good news. I decided to turn off my skimmer 4 days ago and took a nitrate reading of 25. I gave the screen half a clean under the tap 3 days ago and now it has gone mental algae blooming. So i decided to take a nitrate reading today before doing a waterchange and they hadn't budged still at 25 maybe even a little lower. This is awsome. I feed very heavily in my tank and I usually have to clean the glass everyday. Since 3 days ago I havent had to touch the front glass with an algae cleaner and the sides the algae is receding. My sand is also not getting any browner either which would definetly happen if the skimmer was off usually. I upgraded my lighting though to a 18w gro light and a 60w reptile light when turning my skimmer off and this has helped greatly. I am also only using about 2/3rds of a 12x12 screen one side!!!!! WOOOHOOO Gonna do a waterchange and keep an eye on the nitrates but I am impressed so far!!

 

This seems like a **** measuring contest. Happy fighting gentlemen.

 

Really, Liquid Life is LIVE phyto? Some one just might want to re-read the products they use prior to making such posts

Just to save you some time: http://liquidlifeusa.com/Products/Plankton/BioPlankton.html

 

See this is where fact separates from fiction. You do NOT have enteromorpha in your tank. Entreromorpha is NOT "turf algae". Enteromorpha would be pretty damn hard to grow in a tropical aquaria, especially the species you posted You say your have not studied algae before, boy does it show when you post such silly things like the above post. You brush many of us of as we don't agree with you, but you fail to see some of us ARE trained in phycology or work with phycologists Just so you don't have to google it, phycology is the study of algae

Here is a link to the same species you have down there in Santa Monica. Enteromorpha morphology

Your concept I must say is great (new take on old device), but your execution of your posts leaves A LOT to be desired. Such bold claims will only result in people being nay sayers as you have found out in your recent spamming of every single reef forum under the sun

 

Thanks for the link to the "real" algae. I'm sure the readers with N and P problems are happy that you are trying to help them, by showing them what type of algae they may or may not, or could or could not, have on their screens if they tried one. Andy I'm sure they are happy that you really showed me how to properly do a post that really explains N and P reduction for cheap, like the title of the thread says. Matter of fact you should do a series on helping readers with their N and P reduction, since you are so good at providing that information.

 

I don't overload my tanks, all 3 of the setup's I own are 0n 0p and my biggest client's 4 tanks are all overstocked and have nitrate issues but thats what happens when you double the stocking recomendation

I run the needlewheel skimmers on my personal tanks and on my client tanks are needlewheel skimmers and fuges

I haven't said anything derogatory about this system, I've never seen it before but it seems alot like some other things I have seen, just saying I prefer the classic setups, and on time on mine to get 0n 0p as questioned before is none, I let my skimmer do the job it's meant to do, I don't buy cheap equipment and I properly maintain it I don't run carbon or phosphate pads at all and if anyone gets near my tank with tap water they get meant by the "zombie insurance"

 

Iraf that's good that you get zero N and P in your tanks. You won't be needing to change your filtering anytime soon.

 

ive been following this thread from the beginning, and have a question for you, why did you choose to do this style of filtering and who in the heck invented something like that??