Refugium, skimmer or standard filter

Thanks for the advice everyone, I'm definetly going to look into the marcoalgae, frag packs. I'm also going to go ahead and get a skimmer probly the taam Rio or may save up for a better model.

As far as the aquaclear is concerned I'm going to make a refugium out of it and see how it goes but I'm not going to do a heavy mod and cut it all up just in case I want to go back to a regular. I guess I will just go with rubble rock and chaeto. I was also thinking about putting a divided in the middle and putting smaller media on one side, and the chaeto and some rock on the other or would thay just be a dumb idea

I have another question, what is a small sand sifting golby or fish that I could fit in my 20 gallon witch is already stocked with the 2 clowns and damsel, or would that be a bit of stocked and push on space?

 

I'm going to go against the flow here on this thread. I'm going to state my opinion that you could:

- Keep the deep sand bed
- Not have to invest in a skimmer or fuge
- Keep up with weekly 10-15% water changes

Alot of people run to the skimmer option because that's what they know best. In larger systems that tend to be overstocked, skimmers and fuges are a must, IMO. But in small systems, like your 20 gallon, weekly water changes are, IMO, more important that a decent skimmer. It's been proven that even the most efficient skimmer only pull about 20-30% of the DOCs from the water, while replacing the old water with fresh water is a 100% removal. If you're replacing 10-15% a week, that's ~50% DOC removal per month, versus skimmer pulling 20-30% plus another 10% if you do a 10% monthly water change. Of course we could talk differential equations and all that, but I'm trying to simplify the math to make my point.

In small systems, weekly water changes are much more important than skimming. Not to mention you have a light bioload (2 fish), and a DSB, which will aid in nitrate/phosphate reduction.

I say hold off on the skimmer for a few months, and make it a ritual to do a water change every week, and see what happens. Also, check your husbandry, if you're feeding a ton of food, no method of filtration will help you.

I'm sure many will disagree with me, but if you look at nano-reef forums, the major source of "filtration" those reefers rely on is waterchanges. It would be best to do the same for larger systems as well, only it's not very economical.

 

I have to agree with you about the skimmer. I've been looking everwhere online and it really seems you get what you pay for when it comes to skimmers. U don't want to spend 50 or so on something that half the reviews say are a piece of junk if its not even needed. I may just put a little money aside and invest in a better more expensive one for my 40 gallon breeder which I cam set up when I eventually move.

As for now I will probly out one of my old hob filters and make a refugium for some rock rubble and chaeto to grow. Also get some more live rock and upgrade my cleaning crew with some more hermit crabs. Going to also look into other macro algae and of course keep up with water changes.

Thanks everybody

 

That's pretty much a false statement. The study that I think you are referencing states such numbers. However, never has any skimmer claimed to be able to pull out water loving DOCs... only hydrophobic DOC which are proteins. The same study states it removes 100% of those. So stating a skimmer only removes 20-30% total DOCs when in fact protein skimmers remove 100% of what they were designed to remove is disingenuous.

GAC can remove total DOCS, but skimmers can also remove particulates as well.... So removing dissolved protiens and some particulate is quite beneficial to reef tanks... instead of running filter socks and 5 pounds of GAC a week.

 

I dont disagree with the benefits of a skimmer (i run one myself), I'm just debating on behalf of the nano-reefs out there. If you want to debate on the benefits of a protien skimmer, that's another thread (and I'm sure there's plenty of them), but my point it that I'm trying to save the OPer some money, and encouraging some good husbandry. In a small reef, good husbandry far outweights the benefits of a good skimmer. All in my opinion, of course.

I do not, in fact, own a nano-reef. But, I have been doing alot of research in them, as I'm very interested in starting one on my desk at work.

 

OK, but you are the one that brought up the subject. I just felt the statement needed some explaining.

And skimmers benefit small systems just the same as large ones.... only difference is that small ones can make do with changing a large percentage of water regularly as you pointed out. More economical. But that does not make skimming a small tank any less effective.

I'm sure we can both agree the best way to run a reef would be piped in natural sea water from about 12 miles off shore like large aquariums do. Burt we have to work with what we have to work with.;D

... but I don't mean to sound argumentative. I do get what you are saying and I do agree with the point you are making. And saving money is always good in this hobby.

 

Lol, if only we all had that at our disposal.

I know you're not try to stir up a fight, and neither am I, I just felt it was prudent to let the OP know that regular water changes are more economical than a skimmer. I'm not stating that skimmers are not beneficial on nano-reefs, if there's room for double negatives... As to the effectiveness of WC vs. skimming on a nano reef, maybe we can enlist 3reef's own mad scientist, Steve Wright, to do an experiment. ;D

Hope we didnt highjack the thread. I still hope the OP tries the WC routine first, and if he finds that it's just not cutting it, by all means, a skimmer will help in your battle with algea.

 

I would add Purigen to your AC70. and maybe invest in a Tunze skimmer of some sort. The 9002 skimmer is my favorite, but I'm not sure how it would do in the display tank itself. If you converted the AC to a fuge, all you would need is to add a light, and switch the media with rubble and chaeto. good luck.

 

I've been fooling around with some ideas and I think I've landed on a pretty decent one.

I'm thinking of making my own sump to put on the back of my tank with a refugium and a divider for other filter media. My tank sits about a foot from the wall, which I would build a small shelf, go out and get a long plastic container and put it there. The container would sit slightly higer than the tank so I could make a hole and add a return pipe as the water filled up and simply use a pump in the aquarium with a tube to fill it. This way I would have much more room tham making my ac a refugium and could also include other filter media. I wouldn't really be a hang on the back but would function the same way.