stocking your tank from the ocean

BBC Fiji Coral Gardening Video | glassbox-design.com

 

Well as much as I agree...most of my livestock is from the wild. Almost none of my LFS have tankbred specimens for me to buy so I have no other choice.
Also fish that I have like tangs and angelfish and some others... (Not sure) haven't been able to breed on captivity so.
All of my corals are frags and that's because my LFS does provide them.I prefer frags But I'm pretty sure if I didn't have the option of a frag I would still buy it. If it's not me someone else will so it might as well be me.

I do agree that they should really moderate on catching things from the wild, but to the point of none at all I disagree. I think that everything should be with a limit and regulations.

But this is just IMO

 

Great video. I have seen this video before and the same techniques are being practiced around the world now. Coral farming for the aquarium trade using this technique is also very benefitial and growth is rapid. Nothing is more stable that the ocean for most corals.

+K

 

Having grown up in Hawaii I've seen what's been done to damage reefs. I don't agree with your assertion that collection for the marine saltwater aquarium trade is doing any irreversible damage on a scale that puts the worlds oceans in some kind of danger.

You think the coral trade is bad and doing major harm? Ok, I'll concede that some collectors don't care and cause some damage...but... that's nothing compared to what nature and large industry do every day.

I've seen miles long lines several yards wide where large ships have dragged anchor across a reef and left nothing but dead corals and destroyed reef in its wake. This in damage done in the name of commerce, oil, research, and pleasure.

I've seen many square miles of reefs churned up, flipped over, and mostly killed by large storms. This is damage caused by nature and has been going on longer than people have been alive, yet the reefs not only survive, they seem to depend on this occasional "reset" of their environment.

I've seen reefs and their fish destroyed by chemical / oil spills. Accidents like that can kill more fish in a single spill than the aquarium trade imports in a year. These spills happen almost daily around the world.

I've seen shipping channels dynamited and dredged with the resulting rock and rubble just dumped off shore on otherwise healthy and living reefs.


And fish?

Have you ever seen a fishing boat long lining or pulling a net? The term "by catch" refers to all the fish they catch that they're not fishing for. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of TONS of fish are killed every year by commercial food fishing vessels as "by catch" - at least with what we do the goal is to keep them all alive.

A red tide bloom can kill off miles of reef fish.

Hotels tearing up beachfront property to build resorts... kills fish and reefs.

local fisherman bringing home fish to feed their family/community ... what we consider a beautiful and rare exotic specimen someone else considers food.

... so anyways, I don't agree that everyone involved in collecting, dealing in, or buying wild caught fish and corals for the aquarium trade is doing damage that is irreversible or unsustainable.

Now that said I fully agree with and support bans on known dangerous and unsustainable collection techniques like cyanide and dynamiting reef. Technology exists (nets) to collect target specimens without collateral damage to the surrounding environment, and most collectors use these methods. I also agree it's wrong to collect animals that are protected by law or have very low survival rates in aquariums - Hawaiian cleaner wrasses and Moorish Idols would be two good examples.

But what I feel pretty comfortable about is buying fish that have been sustainably harvested, corals that have been fragged in-situ, and live rock that has been collected from storm or otherwise pre-damaged reefs. I would love to see more aquacultured livestock and rock. I would love to be able to buy tank raised fish on a regular basis. But my reason is that they tend to be hardier and certified disease free - NOT because I'm overly concerned with the damage our industry causes.

Protecting the worlds oceans is a valid and altruistic battle, I just think the front you've chosen is a few miles away from where the real action is.

Oh, and re: SWC... a charge from 2008 is hardly an entire story. I would be interested to see what's come of it, but a single charge with no further action is just an accusation, not an indictment. I have an SWC skimmer, so it matters to me that they're not profiting from illegal activity that hurts animals, but with only that charge to go by I am not going to do an about face on what I feel is a well built skimmer for a great price.

-Doug

 

Wasn't picking on coldwater for doing it, looks like an awesome tank, just questioning weather he just walked in and starting grabbing stuff or if he knew what he was grabbing. like others have said there are some species that have a plentiful supply and corals can be fragged right in the ocean.

i'm sorry to say that i based my decision on the answers i got when i asked the owner. He blatently said strait out he still does it but has a way around it. He gets his un suspecting employees to fill out shipping documents to keep his name off of them. I'm not trying to steer people away from these businesses just giving you the information to make an informed decision.

And like i told all of you about the SWC case: i'm local and have seen evidence with my own two eyes, i was offered to help aid this person and was also told for helping i wouldn't be paid in money but in product when i wanted it....how many of you would turn that down? and if you want to follow up on the actions taken by the government in that paticular instance he probably got away with a slap on the wrist cause it didn't change things. even more reason to put pressure on them

what with the dude crying about canada siding with japan on blue fin tuna??

 

Whelp they lied to you I am afraid. There are no Centropyge being bred for commercial consumption and extremely few numbers have even been bred. Frank shut down his operation (the only commercial operation ever breeding Centropyge), but when it was up, they cost several hundred dollars each, up into the low thousands. There is no way in hell you got one for $5 given the hundreds it takes to even grow one.

Well unless you really meant bread, then I guess I am wrong as I ahve no clue what tank bread fish are

 

It could be due to the fish being fished to the point of extinction and your country being one of the few who said it SHOULD NOT BE PROTECTED. Guess Canada feels like Japan... the last one tastes the best

Critically Endangered bluefin tuna receives no reprieve from CITES

Bluefin tuna not protected after Canada sides with Japan

 

Folks, if the thread can continue without personal attacks--then it can remain open. Already I've read a few posts that border on attacking or insulting. Let's state our opinion and move on, please.

While on the subject of stating one's opinion; the first time I saw coldmarineguy's thread I was curious about his harvesting livestock out of his own "backyard." I read on, and discovered that he states it's legal in his area of the world. Irrespective of my opinion, if it's not against the law, then he's within his right--at least legally--to harvest corals. Whether I agree with his practices is my opinion, and whether I care to share it is my right. However, if I do--I'll do my best to be tactful and to respect a fellow marine enthusiast who has not broken the law.

I expect we can all to the same.

The cold hard truth is, at the end of the day, we really don't know where our livestock comes from. Why? Because we're forced to trust the word of another when we make our purchase. Just as a mechanic might "create" problems and a doctor might prescribe another test--all in the name of getting a larger payout, we too are at the mercy of those who sell us goods at their word.

This thread is inherently prone to light that short fuse in some; but again, can be kept open if we can express ourselves objectively, without anger, and with respect for others.

 

Well said greysoul I agree.

 

dude - good point but please lay off of mechanics and doctors! you've got both on this forum...